pros and cons of cavemen

[Mandrake]

to me, cavemen are another melee race to go with S, B and V. i would
almost fit knights in there too but low dexterity and low constitution
are a bummer.

The ChatGPT told me that one of the considered negatives of cavemen are
lack of #twoweapon availability.

That's not really a negative to me because the to-hit penalty of
#twoweapon means I rarely use it. I'm all about to-hit bonus.

The other negative ChatGPT mentioned was a lack of usable weapons.
Again, this is not noticeable in the early game because the club is +1
and the caveman usually starts with 18/03 strength. Maces are available
and also morningstars which is something of a rarity.

Basically what I'm saying is people are usually down on cavemen, but I
don't see any reason for it.

pros

can eat tripe without getting sick
up to 20 wisdom
start with ranged weapon
great strength

[Janis Papanagnou]

Post by Mandrake
to me, cavemen are another melee race to go with S, B and V. i would
almost fit knights in there too but low dexterity and low constitution
are a bummer.

In my early days I didn't consider them as melee role, but they are.
And when I started playing them as such I was pretty successful with
them.

Post by Mandrake
The ChatGPT told me that one of the considered negatives of cavemen are
lack of #twoweapon availability.

For those roles that can do efficient two-weaponing it's worth to
train that.

But the chatbot's reply shows IMO a wrong attempt; we should not so
much assume that every proficiency is a given, and not assume any
"missing" proficiency a negative. Better answers would concentrate
on their specific bonuses.

Post by Mandrake
That's not really a negative to me because the to-hit penalty of
#twoweapon means I rarely use it. I'm all about to-hit bonus.

If he would be proficient in two-weaponing it would be worth using it,
but since he can't there's indeed no point in discussing two-weaponing.

Post by Mandrake
The other negative ChatGPT mentioned was a lack of usable weapons.
Again, this is not noticeable in the early game because the club is +1
and the caveman usually starts with 18/03 strength. Maces are available
and also morningstars which is something of a rarity.

Early game needs some weapon management. Later, when you get artifacts
(depending on your alignment) there's a couple interesting options.
Also the quest artifact is a weapon (unless that has changed in recent
versions) and could be used.

Post by Mandrake
Basically what I'm saying is people are usually down on cavemen, but I
don't see any reason for it.

Their initial gear might not look appealing.

My NH343 ascension statistics show them in the mid range (similar to
my knights), so they don't seem to have the clear advantages that the
other more mundane fighter roles have. Without having done detailed
analysis of their death reasons I suspect that early game cavepeople
may have some more difficulties to survive (if compared to the other
fighter roles)?

Janis